country. I fay, Sir, in prudence as well as modefty; for if we should pretend to be better judges than they, and to compel them or any of them to be of our opinion, we fhall of courfe furnish France with a party in Germany, which may en- A able her to overturn the liberties" of Europe as well as of Germany; because the difpute will not then be about liberty and independency, but whether they shall be obliged to fubmit to the two houfes of Bourbon, or to the two houfes of Brunswick and Auftria. From what I have heard in this debate, Sir, it feems to be almost the unanimous opinion of this affembly, that an election of a king of the Romans would be an additional fecurity for the peace of Europe and tranquillity of Germany, without being of any dangerous confequence to the liberties and privileges of the empire; but it is certain, that this is not the unanimous opinion of the electors and princes of that empire; for if it were, we should have no occafion to grant any fubfidy. With regard to them, the cafe, in my opinion, appears plainly to be thus: There are three electors and many princes, who think an election of a king of the Romans, during the life of the emperor, of fuch dangerous confequence to the liberties and privileges of the Germanick body, that it ought never to be made, without an abfolute and apparent neceflity, for which there is not, they think, the leaft pretence at prefent: There are two, and I be. lieve no more than two electors, who think, or pretend to think, that fuch a neceffity now exifts; And the rest of the electors and princes think the election itfeif a matter of fach indifference, that they may allow themfelves to be determined by a fubfidy from us. In thefe circumflances we may fee, that by granting fubfidies to all thele in с D E G different gentlemen, we may perhaps get at laft a majority to concur in the election of the archduke. Jofeph, even during the life of his father, the prefent emperor. I fay, perhaps; becaufe as the queftion has now been started, whether the electoral college or the diet of the empire be judges of this neceffity, I doubt much if the elector of Mentz will venture to convoke a diet of election, before this queftion be determined, even tho' a majority of the electors fhould concur in requiring it. But fuppofe that we fhould, by means of our subfidies, obtain a majority of the electors, and that we fhould get the elector of Mentz to run the risk of convoking a diet of election at their requeft, the queftion is, whether fuch an election would not rather precipitate a war than protract a peace. We may, I think, be well affured, that thofe who think the election of a king of the Romans a matter indifference, will never join in raifing any disturbance on account of its being delayed, and indeed the delay can furnish no fort of pretence for a war: But will it be the fame, in cafe an election be made against the declared will of three of the moft powerful electors of the empire, and before the diet of the empire has come to any determination with refpect to fuch an election's being neceffary? Will not these three electors think their rights invaded? Will not all the princes of the empire, who are not electors, think their rights invaded? And will not both have at leaft a pretence for faying, that the houses of Auftria and Brunswick, with the help of English money, are going to opprefs the liberties of the Germanick body? Can we think, that thofe electors and princes would fit quietly down under fuch a fuppofed uturpation of their rights; Can we expect that France would not prefently fend her armies again into Germany, under 1753. PROCEEDINGS of the POLITICAL CLUB, &c. under pretence of being called upon as guaranty of the treaty of Weftphalia? 59 account, would be a fquandering of the publick money, because it would be giving away our money for doing that which would certainly be done without our putting ourfelves to any fuch expence. Again, if we fuppofe, that all or most of the electors and princes of Germany think, that the electing of the archduke Jofeph king of the Romans is a matter of fuch indifference, that they may without any danger proceed to it directly, or let it alone till after his father's death; I will fay, that in this cafe, our granting a fubfidy to any one of them, for the fake of haftening the election, would be worse than fquandering, because it would rather retard than forward the election, as every one of the Creft would be for delaying the election, in hopes of getting a like fubfidy from us; and furely, it is not to be imagined, that we can, or ought to grant fubfidies to every elector and prince of Germany upon any account whatsoever. B Such an election, Sir, if it could be brought about, would therefore, in my opinion, be fo far from being an additional fecurity for the peace A of Europe, or the tranquillity of Germany, that I am convinced, it would produce an immediate war in Europe, with this disadvantage, that the greatest part of Germany, and probably both the northern crowns, who are both princes of the empire, would join with France against us; in which cafe the Dutch, I believe, would be wife enough to fecure themselves by a neutrality, as they did in the year 1734, or perhaps, embrace that project lo often offered to them by France, of dividing what is now called the Auftrian Netherlands between them. Thus, Sir, our fuccefs in bringing about fuch an election would, in my opinion, be one of the most unlucky events that could happen to us; but this, I confefs, I do not D much apprehend, becaufe whilst there is a divifion in the empire about the neceffity of chufing a king of the Romans, I believe, the elector of Mentz will never venture to fummon a diet of election. Confequently I must think, that whilft E fuch a divifion fubfifts, our granting of any fubfidy on account of getting the archduke Jofeph chofen King of the Romans, will be an endeavour to purchase what it is not poffible to purchase, and confequendy will be a fquandering of the publick money, which initead of agreeing to, we are in duty bound to prevent. Nay, fuppofing, Sir, that there were no fucn divifion in the empire: Suppofing that all the electors and princes thereof thought it neceflary for the fecurity G of the empire to proceed to an immediate election, and to chufe the archduke Jofeph king of the Romans, yet fill I should think, that our granting of any tubidy upon that I have hitherto fuppofed, Sir, that all the electors and prinses of the empire are men of true honour and publick fpirit, and that none of them can be biaffed by any mercenary confideration to act againit what they think the true intereft of their country: The fartheft I have yet gone is to fuppofe, that fome of them are not men of fuch great forefight and deep penetration as our wife minifters, which is the caufe they think that a mere matter of indifference, which our miF nifters in their great wildem clearly perceive to be of the highest importance: But really from the ar guments made ufe of by the advocates for this motion, one would be apt to imagine, that the electors and princes of Germany, or fome of them at least, are as venal as any of our little boroughs in England, and that if we did not bribe them to act for the intereft of their country, they would accept of bribes H 2 from from France to act against the inter- to the honour of the electors at that on which it was founded. But, Sir, that I may confider this treaty in every poffible light, I hope, I may now join with its advocates, without offence to any member of this houfe, whatever may happen as to others, in fuppofing, that the electors and princes of the empire, or fome of them at leaft, would join with France against us and the true intereft of their country, if we did E have thereby fo much exhausted not prevent it by granting them fubfi- F war; for had it not been for our dies in time of peace as well as war. great fuccefs at fea, and the difficulties and danger which the French colonies and commerce were thereby reduced to, we fhould have been obliged to have offered a carte blanche to our enemies, because it would have been impoffible to have raised money for carrying on the war during another campaign, without feizing upon that fund which is appropriated to pay the intereft, as well 1753. PROCEEDINGS of the POLITICAL CLUB, &c. We must therefore refolve, Sir, 61 can never be attended with lefs dangerous confequences than in the cafe now before us. The next that spoke was L. Valerius Mr. Chairman, A LTHOUGH the Hon. gentle man, who spoke laft, was not pleafed to give us his own opinion, whether he thought an immediate election of the archduke Jofeph a right or a wrong measure, yet he found himfelf obliged to acknowledge, that its being a right measure seemed to be the unanimous opinion of this houfe; and indeed, the cafe is fo clear, that I do not see how it could be otherwife; for if a vacancy in the Imperial throne be an event that must always be attended with the utmost danger of caufing a civil war in Germany, two chances against that event is certainly better than. one. Befides, Sir, that it is a right meafure, and that it will tend to preferve the tranquillity of Germany, and confequently the peace of Europe, is evident from the monftrous fubfidies granted by France to fome of the princes of the empire: E To whom does France grant her fubfidies? Not to any of those princes that are for chufing the archduke Jofeph king of the Romans, but to thofe only who declare themselves against it. Thefe two confiderations, Sir, muft convince every unbiaffed man in Europe, that it is the intereft of the empire to have the archduke Jofeph elected king of the Romans as foon as poffible; But princes are like other men; they are often biaffed, and their underftandings hoodwinked by their pafG fions. Some of them are governed by their ambition, their jealousy, or their refentment; and this prevents their seeing what fo clearly appears Having now, Sir, confidered this F fubfidy in every poffible light, and having fhewn, that in every one it must be deemed a fquandering or worse than fquandering the publick money of this nation, I hope, my affent to the motion will not be expected; for furely we are not to lay it down as a maxim, that we muft grant every foreign fubfidy which our fovereign may be advised by his ministers to promife, and a refufal to be the true intereft of their country: Thefe have been carefully culled out by France, and by large fubfidies enabled to keep numerous armies on foot, in order to intimidate the reft, or at least to render it dangerous for them to pursue the true intereft of their country, by proceeding to an election, and chufing the archduke Jofeph king of the Romans. fire, and what we ourselves allow to be right. What reply can we make ? Can we make any other, than that we will by a fubfidy enable you to keep up fuch an army as may be fufficient for your defence, until we and our A allies can come to your affiftance ? Thefe, Sir, are the true circumflances of Germany at prefent, and in fuch circumftances how are we to B chave? Will any gentleman fay, what it is not the intereft of this nation to prevent a civil war in Germasy Will any one fay, that it is not our intereft to preferve not only The union but the activity of the Germanick body? Can it be fup- C pofed, that the empire is not more expofed to the danger of a civil war duling a vacancy of the Imperial throne, than when it is full? Can it be fuppofed, that the Germanick body can be fo well united or fo attive without a head, as with one D What are we then to do? Certainly, to prevent any fuch vacancy if polible. How are we to do this? The method is plain and obvious: By Pegotiation, by reafon and argument, we must endeavour to remove the prejudices, to overcome the paffions, E 20d to convince the understanding of the electors and princes of the empire, that it is their own intereft to proceed as foon as poffible to an election of a king of the Romans, and to make that choice fall upon the archduke Jofeph. But this is not all we have to do; When we have fucceeded in this with any one or more of them, they will of course anfwer: We approve of what you fay: We fee that what you propofe is right; but there is fuch a one has a great farding army on foot, and G he will prefenty invade us, and wallow up our whole territory before we can petibly provide tor our defence, hould we comply with what you de F Thus, Sir, gentlemen may fee, that the fubfidy is not given, nor accepted, out of any mercenary view. It is given only to enable our friends to act freely, and to defpife the menaces of those, who by their arabition, jealoufy, or refentment are led to oppofe the true intereft of their country, and are hired by France to declare themfelves enemies to this nation. As we defire nothing of any of the princes of Germany but what is for their own intereft as well as ours, it is to be hoped that we shall foon engage fuch a party in Germany as will be able to defpife the menaces of the French party in that country, and when we have done this, we have done our bufinefs; for they will be able to protect the reft, and then all true German patriots may act freely, and may without danger declare themfelves in favour of an election of king of the Romans: Nay, even thofe who are now led by their paffions to oppofe that election, when they fee that they can thereby gratify none of their governing paffions, they may give up their oppofition, and join with the reft of their countrymen in fecuring the future quiet of their country. But fuppofe, Sir, that we fhould not fucceed in getting the archduke Jofeph chofen king of the Romans in the life-time of his father, do gentlemen think that the fubfidies we now grant will be of no fervice? Sir, next to preventing a vacancy in the Imperial throne, the principal thing we are to take care of is, that if fuch a misfortune fhould happen, it fhall be of as short a continuance as poflible; and for this purpose the best thing we can do, is to engage beforeband a majority of the |