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As to the rumor you mention (which was, as Josiah tells me, that I had been deprived of my place in the post-office, on account of a letter I wrote to Philadelphia), it might have this foundation, that some of the ministry had been displeased on my writing such letters, and there were really some thoughts among them of showing that displeasure in that manner. But I had some friends, too, who, unrequested by me, advised the contrary; and my enemies were forced to content themselves with abusing me plentifully in the newspapers, and endeavoring to provoke me to resign. In this they are not likely to succeed, I being deficient in that Christian virtue of resignation. If they would have my office, they must take it.

I have heard of some great man whose rule it was, with regard to offices, never to ask for them, and never to refuse them; to which I have always added, in my own practice, never to resign them. As I told my friends, I rose to that office through a long course of service in the inferior degrees of it. Before my time, through bad management, it never produced the salary annexed to it; and when I received it no salary was to be allowed, if the office did not produce it. During the first four years, it was so far from defraying itself that it became nine hundred and fifty pounds sterling in debt to me and my colleague. I had been chiefly instrumental in bringing it to its present flourishing state, and therefore thought I had some kind of right to it. I had hitherto executed the duties of it faithfully, and to the perfect satisfaction of my superiors, which I thought was all that should be expected of me on that account. As to the letters complained of, it was true I did write them, and they were written in compliance with another duty, that to my country; a duty quite distinct from that of postmaster.

My conduct in this respect was exactly similar to that I held on a similar occasion, but a few years ago, when the then ministry were ready to hug me for the assistance I afforded them in repealing a former revenue act. My sentiments were still the same, that no such acts should be made here for America; or, if made, should, as soon as possible, be repealed; and I thought it should not be expected of me to change my political opinions every time his Majesty thought fit to change his ministers. This was my language on the occasion; and I have lately heard, that, though I was thought much to blame, it being understood that every man who holds an office should act with the ministry, whether agreeable or not to his own judgment, yet, in consideration of the goodness of my private character (as they were

pleased to compliment me), the office was not to be taken from me.

Possibly they may still change their minds, and remove me; but no apprehension of that sort will, I trust, make the least alteration in my political conduct. My rule, in which I have always found satisfaction, is, never to turn aside in public affairs through views of private interest, but to go straight forward in doing what appears to me right at the time, leaving the consequences with Providence. What, in my younger days, enabled me more easily to walk upright, was, that I had a trade, and that I knew I could live upon little; and thence (never having had views of making a fortune), I was free from avarice, and contented with the plentiful supplies my business afforded me. And now it is still more easy for me to preserve my freedom and integrity, when I consider that I am almost at the end of my journey, and therefore need less to complete the expense of it; and that what I now possess, through the blessing of God, may, with tolerable economy, be sufficient for me (great misfortunes excepted), though I should add nothing more to it by any office or employment whatsoever.

I send you, by this opportunity, the two books you wrote for. They cost three shillings apiece. When I was first in London, about forty-five years since, I knew a person who had an opinion something like your author's. Her name was Ilive, a printer's widow. She died soon after I left England, and by her will obliged her son to deliver publicly, in Salters' Hall, a solemn discourse, the purport of which was to prove that this world is the true hell, or place of punishment for the spirits who had transgressed in a better state, and were sent here to suffer for their sins, in animals of all sorts. It is long since I saw the discourse, which was printed. I think a good deal of scripture was cited in it, and that the supposition was, that, though we now remembered nothing of such a preëxistent state, yet after death we might recollect it, and remember the punishments we had suffered, so as to be the better for them; and others, who had not yet offended, might now behold and be warned by our sufferings.

In fact, we see here that every lower animal has its enemy, with proper inclinations, faculties and weapons, to terrify, wound and destroy it; and that men, who are uppermost, are devils to one another; so that, on the established doctrine of the goodness and justice of the great Creator, this apparent state of general and systematical mischief seemed to demand some such supposition as Mrs, Ilive's, to account for it consistently with the honor of the Deity. But our reasoning powers, when employed about

what may have been before our existence here, or shall be after it, cannot go far, for want of history and facts. Revelation, only, can give us the necessary information; and that, in the first of these points especially, has been very sparingly afforded us.

I hope you continue to correspond with your friends at Philadelphia. My love to your children; and believe me ever your affectionate brother, B. FRANKLIN.

[TO SAMUEL COOPER.]

Minutes of a Remarkable Conference with Lord Hillsborough. LONDON, 5 February, 1771.

DEAR SIR: I have just received your kind favor of January 1st by Mr. Bowdoin, to whom I should be glad to render any service here. I wrote to you some weeks since, in answer to yours of July and November, expressing my sentiments without the least reserve on points that require free discussion, as I know I can confide in your prudence not to hurt my usefulness here, by making me more obnoxious than I must necessarily be from that known attachment to the American interest, which my duty, as well as inclination, demands of me.

In the same confidence, I send you the enclosed extract from my journal, containing a late conference between the Secretary * and your friend, in which you will see a little of his temper. It is one of the many instances of his behavior and conduct that have given me the very mean opinion I entertain of his abilities and fitness for his station. His character is conceit, wrongheadedness, obstinacy and passion. Those who would speak most favorably of him allow all this; they only add, that he is an honest man, and means well. If that be true, as perhaps it may, I wish him a better place, where only honesty and well-meaning are required, and where his other qualities can do no harm. Had the war taken place, I have reason to believe he would have been removed. He had, I think, some apprehensions of it himself at the time I was with him. I hope, however, that our affairs will not much longer be perplexed and embarrassed by his perverse and senseless management. I have since heard that his lordship took great offence at some of my last words, which he calls extremely rude and abusive. He * Lord Hillsborough.

assured a friend of mine that they were equivalent to telling him, to his face, that the colonies could expect neither favor nor justice during his administration. I find he did not mistake me.

It is true, as you have heard, that some of my letters to America have been echoed back hither; but that has not been the case with any that were written to you. Great umbrage was taken, but chiefly by Lord Hillsborough, who was disposed before to be angry with me, and therefore the inconvenience was the less; and, whatever the consequences are of his displeasure, putting all my offences together, I must bear them as well as I can. Not but that, if there is to be war between us, I shall do my best to defend myself and annoy my adversary, little regarding the story of the Earthen Pot and Brazen Pitcher. One encouragement I have, the knowledge that he is not a whit better liked by his colleagues in the ministry than he is by me; that he cannot probably continue where he is much longer; and that he can scarce be succeeded by anybody who will not like me the better for his having been at variance with me.

Pray continue writing to me, as you find opportunity. Your candid, clear and well-written letters, be assured, are of great With the highest esteem, I am, my dear friend, &c., B. FRANKLIN.

use.

Minutes of the Conference mentioned in the preceding Letter.
Wednesday, 16 January, 1771.

I went this morning to wait on Lord Hillsborough. The porter at first denied his lordship, on which I left my name, and drove off. But, before the coach got out of the square, the coachman heard a call, turned and went back to the door, when the porter came and said, "His lordship will see you, sir." I was shown into the levee-room, where I found Governor Bernard, who, I understand, attends there constantly. Several other gentlemen were there attending, with whom I sat down a few minutes, when Secretary Pownall* came out to us, and said his lordship desired I would come in.

I was pleased with this ready admission and preference, having sometimes waited three or four hours for my turn; and, being pleased, I could more easily put on the open, cheerful countenance that my friends advised me to wear. His lordship. came towards me and said: "I was dressing, in order to go to court; but, hearing that you were at the door, who are a man of

*John Pownall, Secretary to the Board of Trade, and brother to Governor Pownall.

business, I determined to see you immediately." I thanked his lordship, and said that my business at present was not much; it was only to pay my respects to his lordship, and to acquaint him with my appointment by the House of Representatives of Massachusetts Bay to be their agent here, in which station, if I could be of any service (I was going on to say, "to the public, I should be very happy;" but his lordship, whose countenance changed at my naming that province, cut me short by saying, with something between a smile and a sneer,)

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L. H. I must set you right there, Mr. Franklin; you are not agent.

B. F. Why, my

lord?

L. H. You are not appointed.

B. F. I do not understand your lordship; I have the appointment in my pocket.

L. H. You are mistaken; I have later and better advices. I have a letter from Governor Hutchinson; he would not give his assent to the bill.

B. F. There was no bill, my lord; it was a vote of the House.

L. H. There was a bill presented to the governor, for the purpose of appointing you and another, one Dr. Lee, I think he is called, to which the governor refused his assent.

B. F. I cannot understand this, my lord; I think there must be some mistake in it. Is your lordship quite sure that you

have such a letter?

L. H. I will convince you of it directly. (Rings the bell.) Mr. Pownall will come in and satisfy you.

B. F. It is not necessary that I should now detain your lordship from dressing. You are going to court. I will wait on your lordship another time.

L. H. No, stay: he will come immediately. (To the servant.) Tell Mr. Pownall I want him.

(Mr. Pownall comes in.)

L. H. Have not you at hand Governor Hutchinson's letter, mentioning his refusing his assent to the bill for appointing Dr. Franklin agent?

Sec. P. My lord?

L. H. Is there not such a letter?

Sec. P. No, my lord; there is a letter relating to some bill for the payment of a salary to Mr. De Berdt, and I think to some other agent, to which the governor had refused his assent. L. H. And is there nothing in the letter to the purpose I mention ?

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